brent(inWorship) - Latest Comments in What Do You Think?

Re: What Do You Think?

inworship — Sat, 02 Aug 2008 11:17:50 -0000

Joni, I hear you. I would never advocate that Christians making music disappear, but I would hope that we continue to work towards less separation and instead more non conforming.

Thanks for jumping in!

Re: What Do You Think?

Joni Ruhs — Sat, 02 Aug 2008 06:17:49 -0000

Hmm. Should you have to pay to hear the gospel message? Well, if you want to attend a concert and invite a friend in the hopes they will hear a message about Jesus, then you buy their ticket. If your friend has not seen a message about Jesus through your friendship, then you've got a different issue. I wish there wasn't a designation although as a mom, its nice to have a couple radio stations with music I don't have to edit with my kids in the car.

Joni Ruhs's last blog post...Loneliness and the church

Re: What Do You Think?

inworship — Fri, 01 Aug 2008 17:09:09 -0000

Thank for your thoughts Love.

I am putting them all into consideration for my future post.

Re: What Do You Think?

love — Fri, 01 Aug 2008 06:16:06 -0000

Christian Industry? Hmmm.......

Christ has become a business venture?? Hmmm....

I still say He was a Communist!

Feels like something went seriously wrong somewhere to me :-(

Too many of us want to be 'of the Earth' and not just 'on' it.

I haven't seen anything in the Bible that tells me Jesus needed to get paid to spread His message?

An honest wage for an honest day's work is fine... if that's the way you are 'told' to live i guess?

But who's word's are we listening to ? His? or the rest of our Society's?

love's last blog post...Seven Deadly Sins - Part V. LUST !

Re: What Do You Think?

inworship — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 18:40:08 -0000

So it sounds like there is a lot of consensus about Christian vs Secular terminology.

Re: What Do You Think?

darla — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 12:01:26 -0000

I hate the segregation that happens between Christian/secular..there is some I hate on both sides,and some I love on both sides..
It really puts a wall up between believers and nonbelievers, and how am I supposed to reach anyone if this dang wall is in between? I say tear it down..I love so many types of music... should I pay for them? YES I believe it is how God is providing for them as the travel perform, spread HIS word..man I have spent 2 sometimes 3 times the amount to see secular bands...and it was worth it to me..

darla's last blog post...Blogging Bible Study-John 2

Re: What Do You Think?

alece — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:58:02 -0000

i don't have time to catch up on all these comments (BLAST!), but here are my two cents:

i grew up in a household that had a HUGE dividing line between christian and secular. we weren't allowed to listen to "secular music"; we never had cable; pg-13 movies were STRICTLY off limits (as, of course, were r-rated ones).

as an adult, i've wrestled through some of these things to form my own opinions. i think everything is sacred, and i can find God anywhere i look for Him.

my stomach also turns at the thought of the christian marketing behind things like WWJD and the prayer of Jabez. i mean, really - we slap those phrases on anything (coasters, candles, toilet paper!) and sell them in christian bookstores and suddenly we've got holy toiletries?!?! it bothers me, as does all cheesy marketing, but unfortunately the MAJORITY of "christian" stuff out there today leans towards the cheesy/poorly done/lacking in excellence side.

that was a little disjointed and rambly. sorry.

alece's last blog post...pack it up

Re: What Do You Think?

Mark Thomas — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:55:00 -0000

I'll pay a lot of money for good Christian entertainment. In 2005 I spent about $500 on U2 tickets. Now that's church!

Re: What Do You Think?

inworship — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:31:16 -0000

I am loving this discussion. It strays from my original thoughts a bit, but still needs it's space. I have creatyed a new post for this discussion.

http://brentinworship.com/b...

Re: What Do You Think?

BuddyO — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 09:48:45 -0000

Sure chorus... Verse anyone??

Re: What Do You Think?

Bernard Shuford — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 09:28:13 -0000

Hello Hello Hello Hello
Hello Hello Hello Hello

Something about an albino, a mosquito, a mulatto, and something else I can't remember.

Bernard Shuford's last blog post...OHP July 30, 2008 - Week Two, Day One

Re: What Do You Think?

badguy — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 09:21:08 -0000

I feel stupid and contagious. here we are now entertain us. - best I can do this early in the a.m...

badguy's last blog post...What year is this? oh yeah, 2008…

Re: What Do You Think?

BuddyO — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 09:01:46 -0000

Test... I think feedburner and WP2.6 upgrade was messing up my 'luv'.

let's see...

Re: What Do You Think?

BuddyO — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:52:21 -0000

Certianly I agree with many of the feelings here regarding Christian Entertainment.

There is another side to it however. It's really not fair to the artist. If someone wants to make a living or better yet wants to get a message out, why pigeon hole them into a micro-market? If they want maximum exposure either for their message or to make money (there's nothing wrong with wanting to make money), the mainstream is where they need to market. If it's good music people will buy it. Without Googling can anyone tell me the lyrics to Nirvana's "Smells Like Teen Spirit"??? I can't, but the song is great, in fact it's a pivotal song in music history. My point... (do I have one)... just make good music and make it available to everyone.... whoever likes it will buy it.

Re: What Do You Think?

BuddyO — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:45:39 -0000

MT said:

does that mean we don’t have to “pay” our preachers/teachers/those who are setting aside their lives to serve us spiritually?

Simple answer - YES

Re: What Do You Think?

Bernard Shuford — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:37:21 -0000

Lotsa comments about "Christian" stuff being "cheap" and "low quality".

Christians are the world's biggest cheapskates, often in the name of "good stewardship".

Is the general consensus that the "manufacturers" or "artists" should provide higher quality "stuff" for the same price, or are we willing to properly compensate them for stepping it up a notch? I'm hearing a lot of people saying that $25 is too much to pay to see Christian musicians. Are you all aware that top notch mainstream stuff like Blue Man Group sells their CHEAPEST tickets for something around EIGHTY bucks per seat? The front row goes for $1000?????? A buddy of mine just paid nearly $200 for TWO tickets to see Cheap Trick. Are "we" ready to pay that kind of money to see the "quality" of "Christian" music or "entertainment"?

The mainstream world has a lot more clientele. A lot bigger audience. Just read this thread - a lot of CHRISTIANS don't even like Christian music. It's a vicious cycle. We think the stuff should be better, but we really would rather spend our money on something else. Paradoxical, huh. :)

Re: What Do You Think?

Adam — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:18:24 -0000

Ok.. let me join in the mix here. I don't mind spending money on Christian stuff but like someone said at the top about Christian stuff being "cheap" I really agree. I mean the majority of stuff out there is painfully cheesy. I try to watch some of the stuff with my daughter and just can't. The same goes for concerts.. I don't have a problem spending money to go see artist.. but I want to have a good time. I dont want to walk out of a concert and be like.. ehh.. i could have just stayed home and save the $25 for on the ticket. But groups like Mercy Me, TobyMac, Third Day have awesome shows. I think the Christian Market as a whole needs to look at Quality of what they are putting out instead of just putting sub standard stuff out there.

Adam's last blog post...Start of Another Week...

Re: What Do You Think?

badguy — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 08:05:55 -0000

There's a lot of interesting thoughts being posted here. I thought it was interesting that Mandy thinks it's okay to pay people to 'minister' to us, whether they are musicians or preachers. I question the whole concept of ministry v. profession (which isn't really where you were taking this Brent, but another interesting topic.

"alternative forms of “fun” that aren’t morally questionable" - that's another statement loaded with implications (I'm not trying to pick on you Mandy, but what you said stuck with me). I think the concept of alternative entertainment is a major reason why we have the christian subculture/consumerism in the first place. I've been to churches that offer "Royal Rangers" and "Missionettes" instead of boy and girl scouting. Then there's all those private christian schools? Christian mentioned the "Shepherd's Guide" - that's been around the DC/MD/VA area for 20-30 years.

Nate mentioned Romans 12:2 where Paul tells us to no longer CONFORM to the pattern of the world. How is developing a "christian" alternative for just about everything the world has to offer not conforming to the world? Usually it's just a cheap and inferior alternative - but the same.

Another passage has Jesus praying to the Father before he is arrested (John 17:15-19): "MY PRAYER is NOT that you take them OUT of the world but that you protect them from the evil one. They are not of the world, even as I am not of it. Sanctify them by the truth; your word is truth. As you sent me into the world, I HAVE SENT THEM INTO THE WORLD. For them I sanctify myself, that they too may be truly sanctified."

This was Jesus talking to the Heavenly Father - you might imagine that Jesus was (and is) totally connected to the perfect will of the Father, so you would conclude that his prayers are not mere wishes. Jesus is speaking from a place of authority and fore-knowledge that WE (His followers) will BE IN THE WORLD - and that we will be SAFE.

Christian entertainment - isn't that throwing believers to the lions?
We're on a mission; we don't need entertainment.

Christian subculture - the NT church grew despite the culture in which it found itself, but it was essentially counter-culture and underground; operating outside the bounds of the reigning society.

We are to live our lives among the lost and broken as witnesses for Jesus the Christ; a city on a hill, a light to the darkness, salt.
This is not an easy calling, nor one we should take lightly. We must be intentional in our interactions with others - be they believers or the lost, and we must be showing the way to Jesus, not a different CD or clothing aisle at WalMart.

badguy's last blog post...What year is this? oh yeah, 2008…

Re: What Do You Think?

Brad Ruggles — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 07:38:41 -0000

I'll admit, there are times I wish I could revert to some of my legalistic upbringing - at least with my kids. It would be so much easier if I could just separate everything into black and white, Christian and secular.

But I think God wants me to raise my children to be more discerning than simply accepting music, books or entertainment simply because they have been labeled as "Christian."

Brad Ruggles's last blog post...Photos by Daley Hake

Re: What Do You Think?

Mark Thomas — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 02:28:49 -0000

I have no problem paying for "Christian" entertainment, I just don't do it often because there's not much "Christian" entertainment that is entertaining enough to warrant a fee.

Look, yes these folks are ministering to the people, but they have also worked and trained and practiced and bled to get good at their craft. They deserve to make money doing it. If they didn't make money doing it then there's no way they could be out there 200+ days per year evangelizing. God gave them the gift, they did the work. To God be the glory, to the worker go the hire.

Re: What Do You Think?

Momma Jen — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 00:32:03 -0000

Many thoughts:
I don't mind at all purchasing "Christian" music, books, t-shirts, etc. I would much rather support an artist that is glorifying God (Jeremy Camp, Jeremy Riddle, Kutless) versus any other artist that is not("secular," "mainstream," "Christian," or otherwise).
As much as I agree it should be a "noun," I guess in this regard it has to be an "adjective." It would be like asking someone what kind of music they prefer: Country, Punk, Reggae, Christian.
T-shirts & bumper stickers are more or less the same: they speak of one's attitude(s), opinion(s), etc. I took my kids to DQ not that long ago and there was a teenager (with a father-like figure) having ice cream, wearing a t-shirt that said "F*** You!" - unfortunately, the actual word was used. I would have MUCH rather seen (or even more so, my kids) a t-shirt that read: "Jesus loves you," or "If you're living like there is no God, you better be right," or "My boss is a Jewish Carpenter." I don't think there is a t-shirt out there that has brought anyone to Christ, but I'm sure they have made a few people stop & think.
Now I need to go put my $4.99 "Jesus Fish" on my car. :)

Re: What Do You Think?

inworship — Wed, 30 Jul 2008 00:28:17 -0000

Hahaha!!!

This outta be fun :)

And yes, I am a gentlemen, she can go first...

Re: What Do You Think?

5th Street — Tue, 29 Jul 2008 23:21:40 -0000

Brent, I have to inform you I just declared War on your wife. Nothing personal, and I will lower any big bombs I will let you know first for you are a gentleman sir, but I have to do what needs to be done. I am truly sorry it has come to this!

5th Street's last blog post...Blog Retreat Update!!

Re: What Do You Think?

inworship — Tue, 29 Jul 2008 23:09:22 -0000

C, you picked a plumber. Haha. that made me laugh...I don't know why :)

Bad, I figured some of that might come up.. can't say it will part of my post though.

Re: What Do You Think?

TheNorEaster — Tue, 29 Jul 2008 23:08:49 -0000

I love God. I love my country. But that..."BushFish"....?

Uh uh. Nope.

TheNorEaster's last blog post...The Light of the World