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Odgie's last blog post...God loves wrestling
Bridging the Gap Between People
To become neighbours is to bridge the gap between people. As long as there is distance between us and we cannot look in each other's eyes, all sorts of false ideas and images arise. We give them names, make jokes about them, cover them with our prejudices, and avoid direct contact. We think of them as enemies. We forget that they love as we love, care for their children as we care for ours, become sick and die as we do. We forget that they are our brothers and sisters and treat them as objects that can be destroyed at will.
Only when we have the courage to cross the street and look in one another's eyes can we see there that we are children of the same God and members of the same human family."
I think this can apply inside or outside the church (though some might rephrase "children" to "creations" in the last sentence to apply to non-believers.
For me, I just want to rightly represent the One I belong to wherever (and alongside whomever)He places me. Right now, my life is centered around ministry to my parents, with a little left over for ministry that directly represents Him in various venues (inside and outside the church walls).
Wherever I am though, the most important thing, I believe, is not "what people think of me, but what people think of HIM because of me." So, "whether I eat or drink or do whatever" my aim is that it all be for His glory (1 Cor. 10:31). Hopefully the difference (between this motivation and 'the world's') will be noticeable even without direct verbal 'witness'.
D-
Odgie, I have always wondered why the church so often refuses or bans art (of whatever kind). I understand the background or purpose f some art, but art and music in itself is not evil. I really believe God created us and all of it and it is either being used to glorify God or self.
D, yes!
I completely agree and think that this can be done in and outside as well.
Why is the church so secluded from culture? POWER.
Why are we taught to invite people to church instead of making friends and spending time at their place and teaching by example–or going out as “a sheep among the wolves”? FEAR OF LOSING THAT POWER.
Not a pleasant truth. But A truth nonetheless. Most people just don’t see it.
“Christianity stands or falls with its revolutionary protest against violence, arbitrariness, and pride of power and with its plea for the weak. Christians are doing too little to make these points clear rather than too much. Christendom adjusts itself far too easily to the worship of power. Christians should give more offense, shock the world far more, than they are doing now. Christians should take a stronger stand in favor of the weak rather than considering the first possible right of the strong.” ~Dietrich Bonhoeffer, “Sermon on 2 Corinthians 12:9″ 1934
TheNorEaster's last blog post...It’s Christmas (Baby, Please Come Home)
We can see ourselves as something "more special" than others. God sees us all as His creation. I cant believe that I am any better or more special. I need to share what God has proven to me with those that have not listened yet.
Most often the "unpleasant truth" is the one we most need to hear!
tam's last blog post...So christians DO enjoy sex!
Tyler's last blog post...Lunch Time
I am finding for myself(how I respond), that I have to extend myself to them or I am apt to "shun" them. I am learning everyday to allow God to show me my boundaries, so that I can enjoy and appreciate and yet uphold His standard for my life. It's easy for me to hate something, so I tend to let it soak in and allow Him to direct me through it.
I will add. "No one lights a lamp and puts it under a basket."
Some times the four walls of our church become our basket. We hoard the light for our selves, and we don't allow others to see what Christ has done for us, and bask in the light of His Glory.
Am I scared of Culture? Yes and No... Yes, because I feel unworthy sometimes to be God's voice in the darkness when He needs me to be. No, because I have the light of Christ to guide me.
Love conquers all, and to just get over ourselves and love is all God wants. Just pour it out, just as Jesus' love was poured out with his blood. Jesus broke it down to something a simple as a drink of water for the least. A DRINK OF WATER, but we make it so hard. If Christ's Church could just figure out the "Drink of Water" the world and it's culture would be a better place.
ckroboth's last blog post...God is not a vending machine,
Ric's last blog post...Knight of My Rescue, iii
What a great post.. really gets me thinking.
Adam's last blog post...Love Grass?!?
Question: When a peacock shows it's plumage does it do so for the glory of God or just to get in some hens pants? Doesn't matter does it? Either way it's a glorious display of God's creativity.
As far as being scared... what is there to be scared about? I know who is by my side, I know what good choices are and bad. Could I possible go to a strip bar and honor my wife? Of course not so that's off the list. It's really not that hard... and life is so much fuller being free from the walls that bind...
BuddyO's last blog post...An Unfortunate Choice of Words
Great post man!!
Brad Ruggles's last blog post...10 Blogging Terms You Should Know and Use
This started some questions for me like, How does the command not to be conformed to this world relate to Paul’s statement in 1 Corinthians 9:22, “I have become all things to all people, that by all means I might save some”? How is becoming all things to all people not conforming to the world? Or how does the command not to conform to the world, relate to Paul’s words in 1 Corinthians 10:32-33? “Give no offense to Jews or to Greeks or to the church of God, just as I try to please everyone in everything I do, not seeking my own advantage, but that of many, that they may be saved.” How does not being conformed to the world fit with not giving offense to the world? I can’t always do both. How does not being conformed to the world fit with pleasing everyone for the sake of salvation? I can’t always please people if I refuse to conform to some of their thoughts and ways.
I hear, Christians are in the world but not of the world. Jesus prays, “I do not ask that you take them out of the world, but that you keep them from the evil one. They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world” (John 17:15-16)
Or we say Christians should be separate from the world and yet participate in the world. 2 Corinthians 6:17 “Therefore go out from their midst, and be separate from them, says the Lord, and touch no unclean thing.”
How do we get balance? For me it is “be transformed by the renewal of your mind that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.” I no longer have qualms about people or their state of existence. I praise God for it, it was a long time of seeking to get there….but we really enjoying being in the world…it’s an amazing place out there.
Debs's last blog post...Can we just love?
Mandy's last blog post...Positive Post Tuesday
Elaine's last blog post...Visit to see friends
I feel this way often, but your right, He is there to guide.
Ric, the line can definitely be blurred at times.
Adam, you are right about the "bubble". I was a part of a great conversation about the bubble last year and it really revealed to me how self focused we as a church can be. We need to ask ourselves the tough questions.
BuddyO, I completely agree! The idea that all gifts are given of God is something I hold on strong to. There have been times where people have said that music or art is evil. I have even heard people say that a gift someone has is from satan and not from God. Hogwash. God created us, God made us beautiful. Sin has corrupted and we either glorify Him or self.
Brad,
Well said!
Deb, great stuff. The balance can be hard, is we are self focused. but like you said. He renews out minds and He then tests and approves.
Mandy, I encounter them as well. Dare I say that I have been one myself. I'm learning. You are fortunate to know both sides, so you can see it as it is.
Elaine, it can be lonely and sad, especially when God has called us to be a light and to be salt. We can't do that in separation.
Indian Lake Papa's last blog post...Pray for Brittany!
darla's last blog post...Christians rant? WHAT!
Brent, this post makes me think of that church we went to with my friend here....remember the email I sent you?? Definately people afraid of culture. It is frustrating.
I think a lot of times when people are afraid of culture (like music, or a good drink for instance) it's almost like an excuse to say "Look at me, I'm so much more righteous than you" when it's not even about that at all. I guess they're better than Jesus too b/c if I remember correctly, he was around a lot of culture himself. ;-)
I'm still kinda bent on that whole church experience. It has bothered me a lot to know that people think like that. *sigh*
Brandy's last blog post...One of *those* days, and it’s only 11am
darla's last blog post...Christians rant? WHAT!
tawny's last blog post...Confession.....
Darla, you are right. When we struggle with aspects of life and culture, we need to keep ourselves free of it. Not the people, but the lifestyles. This is most definitely appropriate.
Brandy, I was thinking of your experience after I wrote this. It is sad that some choose to completely board themselves up from God's creation. They almost act as if, they are the only one God notices.
Tawny, agreed. And I think TV has taken so much control over people that it has become it's own culture. And many times, a scary one.
darla's last blog post...Christians rant? WHAT!
darla's last blog post...Christians rant? WHAT!
Besides, Larry Norman said "There's nothin' wrong with playin' these blues licks"
scott's last blog post...The Gore(y) Details
SERIOUSLY. That is what I was thinking 100% while there. "Oh no I'm wearing jeans, God doesn't see me according to them." Or, "I listen to Christian rock music, I must be invisible." :roll:
She also saw my myspace pictures of our Christmas party, pictures of us drinking, and she wasn't too impressed by that. I got the same look from her I used to get from my mom when I was a teenager. It was odd.
Darla, you would DIE laughing at this church I'm talking about, it was awful. I'll email you about it later. ;-)
Brandy's last blog post...One of *those* days, and it’s only 11am
But....I've had more opportunities to have meaningful conversations about God with people I've met in bars than in many bible studies I've participated in. It's interesting that, if and when the subject finally comes up, if you've had chance to share a beer or two with someone first, their eyes tend to not glaze over quite so quickly.
Christian's last blog post...10 Answers to the Question: Is the Church Still Relevant?
I think so. And I think we would be wise to be relevant to those around us as well.
carrie's last blog post...Wordless Wednesday: Corn King
Tyler - "in the world and not of the world" is not actually scripture (God didn't speak it), although I agree with the concept. What did happen was that Jesus prayed that we would NOT be taken out of the world, but that we would be kept safe from the evil one while we are and continue to be IN the world (John 17). That's Jesus talking to God and assuming that we are IN the world - so it's not really a question that needs to be asked.
The Doctrine of separation that I've seen reflected in some folks' posts (mostly about their upbringings from which they are trying to break free) is dead wrong. We must be in the world and among the world.
Our model is Jesus. He was God and was with God and He had whatever goes along with being the Master of the Universe. He gave that up and put on skin so he could reach us. That was a significant step down in terms of his comfort zone, don't you think? We MUST do the same. There's a line from a Derek Webb song that says, "we must become what we want to save."
What most of us need to do is simply walk outside and look around, see someone, and then go and engage them in relationship. No formulas, no 4-step programs, just simply get to know them and care about them. Oh, that takes time btw. After time, and building trust, you'll come to discover what the person's needs are, and you'll get an idea how to meet them. Then one day, in God's perfect timing, a door will open, you'll feel the call of the Holy Spirit to say something, do something, answer a question - who knows?
Pay attention. Look. Listen. Act. Engage. Be.
That's the church in action.
badguy's last blog post...Seeking God
Debs's last blog post...Can we just love?
Brandy, I am sure Darla will enjoy your story :)
Christian, it was kind of fun Monday to hang out with Joe (the lead guitarist of the group). I've run sound for his band for 2 years now when at the fair and so we've become light friends. At the gig Monday, he would come over and talk to us and at one point bought me a drink for all y help at the fair last week. It was after he bought me the drink that he sat down and we began to talk about what I did. Turns out he is playing with a couple of Christian's in another band(that we are going to go listen to on Friday). he has the utmost respect for these two Christian players. And in turn respects Tammy and I. Over a drink, we got to share our lives with him. We enjoyed all aspects of that.
Carrie, relevant is always such a weird word to me, but if we are to look at it as "relating", Jesus most definitely sought to relate and reach out to others.
Bad, I wasn't supposing as much as trying to define my use of the word. But, I agree with how you've used it and your assessment. The people have created this institution and unfortunately so many just go along with it and in doing so, they become a willing party to it. It is a sad process.
Yes...yes...yes! Like you said, "engage". We have to engage culture.
Deb, I'll help protect the Jeep :)
bearing upon or connected with the matter in hand; pertinent: a relevant remark. (per dictionary.com)
synonyms include: appropriate, applicable, fitting, and suitable.
I think you knew what I meant, but that's how I use relevant. Behaving toward people in a way that is applicable to where they are in the culture.
I think that being relevant like that allows us to listen and understand better.
Where relevant can blur the line is when it tries to conform. Jesus definitely didn't do that. But I don't think you were saying that...just adding more thoughts :)
But I'll just go my own direction, here. I LOVE culture. I love people's stories. I firmly believe that every human being has a story- who am I not to listen?? I love going to Irish pub and enjoying a beer over fish n chips...w/ friends talking about life. This is a culture norm, esp common to my heritage, that I enjoy b/c it's gathering w/ people over a part of society and being able to build relationships.
The blues night out? Amazing...
Every person has talents and gifts. They may not say God in them, but that doesn't mean they are not from God, nor does it mean that the music, art, etc is not beautiful, b/c it is. Jesus went to the people, ate, drank and shared w/ them.
Someone said earlier that the Church often misses out on that b/c of Power. I agree. One of the things I love about the Catholic church, for example, is that most of them are still in the middle of neigborhoods and they have a high value for serving the community around them. I don't see as many Evangelical churches doing that...kinda breaks my heart. Non christian people aren't scary. They just don't have Jesus. But what a difference we can make by just being w/ them, hanging out w/ them, giving them ourselves, treating them like people.
ash's last blog post...Brains are Beautiful
In America it is very hard to isolate ourselves from different cultures, except for the very rich, or some cults. In all the comments preceding comments I have read I don't see anyone who is trying to isolate themselves from the rest of the humanity.
I think the greatest strength of America is that it is a melting pot. I would say in that regard the more we try to isolate ourselves the less American we are, at least in spirit.
Anyone who wants to "spread the word" has got to reach out beyond their own community. It's also simply a lot more fun to discover new food, new music, new friends.
Great topic, great discussion Brent.
Ed's last blog post...Summer Music
I think blogging is a way to have a cross-cultural experience, perhaps from the 'safety' of our own homes - but what the hey.
Ed - you may be right that blogging will help the world come together. I pray that is true. So, I'm not surprised that the people who gravitate to Brent's blog already have a heart to reach out to other people/cultures/unsaved/etc. but unfortunately there are groups within the Christian sub-culture that have built doctrine specifically around being separate, distinct, and effectively cut-off from the world.
How many of us have done "outreach" by inviting folks to come to church, maybe by passing out fliers, or hanging up door-knob-tracts, or leaving Bibles at the doorstep? How many of us seek out "family friendly" forms of entertainment in the media? How many of us have been taught to not listen to certain music, or watch certain films, or go to certain places, or associate with "those types of people"?
Fortunately, I think most of the folks blogging here have come to understand, or are starting to understand that being a Christian involves being intentional in relationship with other human beings.
We must be three things: relevant, relational, and real. Just remember the three "R"s and you'll be walking in His steps.
badguy's last blog post...Seeking God
I believe this wholeheartedly. Thanks for your thoughts.
Ed,
Right on ed!
Bad, I love the 3 R's!
Just thought I'd throw that in there...
But seriously...I've known a lot of Christians who have had struggles with religious legalism, which appeals to some people because the world at large is so chaotic. A sense of order, of control, oftentimes brings a sense of relief to people. It creates a false sense of meaning and purpose in a world seriously lacking.
This, of course, echos my previous comment somewhere up there. Because there are some pastors and a whole lot of leaders who manipulate our longing for order, for a sense of control when we feel our lives are spinning out of control. For how quickly have people fallen in line behind a bad leader?
The advantage that Brent has, now, as a grown man, is he can expose himself to blues players and bands and go out and have a good time because he has a solid foundation. When you're young and stupid, you think all the dumb things people do in bars and clubs is the way your life is supposed to be at that age.
Nothing wrong with going out and having a few drinks with friends--and I DO mean A FEW, not "a few" for those who think they can "handle" getting "hammered" (believe me, I know how THAT story ends)--but Brent also has an advantage of going out with Tam, who is also a strong Christian, and that probably helps the both of them to stay focused on Who is really important. (Hint: It's not Brent OR Tam. ;) )
Beer
Brats
Bowling
(I just made that up - feel free to substitute the third B...)
Bad, so the first 2 are non-negotiable :)
Accountability for that 'renewed mind' is crucial to both rightly represent Christ to the world and not 'stumble' weaker Christians who might see us in that environment (especially for 'up front' people like you two).
I have a feeling Nor could attest (as well as many more) of Christians WITHOUT renewed minds doing extreme damage to the world's perceptions of 'Christians'. (I think non-believers can be even more aware of our 'inconsistencies' than fellow believers are at times.)
Nick's brother fell away because of 'believers' who didn't 'walk the talk' (not that he didn't make his own wrong choices too) and 30+ years later still has no interest in 'Christianity' (even with many 'positive' examples within his immediate family).
As to your comment in #18, I agree that God is the giver of good gifts (James 1:17), but Satan sure can have his hand in diverting them to his purposes (to glorify evil or self). Do we not think Satan is 'gifted', and who do we think his gifts originated from (Ezek. 28:11-17)?
It is a delicate balance, and I think Papa's video comment about getting 'filled up' with more of Him IN ORDER TO go out is a needed word for maintaining our 'balance' and not tripping others up also.
It all has to be directed by Him and empowered by His Spirit renewing our minds to communicate His words and actions, motivated by His love for believers and non-believers alike.
D-
badguy's last blog post...Seeking God
D-
I become a pumpkin after 10 PM though (especially getting up at 5 AM and no nap today) ={.
See ya?
D-